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Poster: Uncle Jimmy Date: Jan 25, 2005 6:38am
Forum: etree Subject: Re: quallity loss?

Please, please, please do yourself a favor and just get a big, possibly external HD for shn/flac storage. Otherwise, you will end up with two sets of CDs for all your shows, and you will end up putting them back on your machine at some point. I don't even burn audio discs very often anymore, with the iPod and all. (yes, you cna put lossless music on an "MP3" player.)

Your CDs WILL FAIL at some point down the road. Plus, you have to lug them around. If you have one HD with your .wav files on it for burning and playing, and anoter HD with your archive shn/flac, then even if one fails completely, you still have everything on the other and can get it back.

Please. Don't waste more CDs.

YMMV, just my $.02,
-Jim

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Poster: Administrator, Curator, or Staffgreenone Date: Jan 26, 2005 4:29am
Forum: etree Subject: Re: quallity loss?

Please, please, please do yourself a favor and just get a big, possibly external HD for shn/flac storage.

Yes, but...HD's fail too. I'd rather lose one show to a scratched CD than hundreds to a hard drive going up in flames.

The best protection, of course, is to trade your collection around, so you can get a copy from one of your trading partners. Reminds me of the Steven Wright joke: "I have a large seashell collection, which I keep scattered all over the beaches of the world...maybe you've seen it."

--Dave

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Poster: Uncle Jimmy Date: Jan 26, 2005 4:36am
Forum: etree Subject: Re: quallity loss?

just read the rest, baby. one for shn/flac, one for wav. lose one drive, recreate it with the other.

again, just my $.02

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Poster: little brother Date: Jan 26, 2005 4:00pm
Forum: etree Subject: Re: quallity loss?

Why is it my cd's will eventually fail? Please explain because I kinda thought that taken proper care of they were forever, or like they dont fade in time as a tape might.

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Poster: Uncle Jimmy Date: Jan 26, 2005 9:16pm
Forum: etree Subject: Re: quallity loss?

Not sure specifically "why" but some of my older ones have begun to flake. this was an ongoing source of discussion on the etree lists, and while there is no definitive answer as to a time limit, i.e. some types are much more or less durable than others, it still remained that these are not "100 year" devices. maybe 10 or so. don't know how old you are, but i have sweaters older than that.

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Poster: little brother Date: Jan 27, 2005 2:00pm
Forum: etree Subject: Re: quallity loss?

I'm old enough to have had some of my disk well over ten years and , not to say I havent ended up with lottsa flakey copies too, but say the ones that I never cared much for and so haqVE NOT LISTENED TO AS MUCH,( OR NOT AT ALL) but these disk that stay in the case on the shelf, I believe like that they very well should last100 plus. Of course the favorites get exposed to all sorts of nasty enviroments, heat, cold, dust, and even spinning in players could caulse wear.
I have some disk that were bought when cd's were considered brand new tech. 80s hair, stuff better off on the shelf where it sits now. It looks and plays like new, if you're brave enough.
Of course I have old albums from the early 60's that look and play like new also. I can't really say about recorded disk, but it would seem that with good quallity burners and ect. there would'nt be a lot of difference. peace

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Poster: glenn Date: Jan 29, 2005 7:43am
Forum: etree Subject: Re: quallity loss?

cds and dvds are likely good for 5-10 years with use, longer with meticulous care, clean environment, no UV exposure etc.

Good News: The one way to keep archived data around forever is to continually copy it to new discs... and since these shn files are shared among thousands, if you find that one track or one disc or one show has 'gone bad', just let your friends know you need to replace it. somewhere there is still a good copy available. In other words, the more you share your shns and flacs, the longer they will last, regardless of if you save them to HDD or CD or DVD or 'New technology superduperdisc'... sharing music is the One True Perfect Archive Solution.

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Poster: little brother Date: Jan 29, 2005 1:54pm
Forum: etree Subject: Re: quallity loss?

I DO AGREE WITH THIS 100%. aND i VERY MUCH respect your oppinion on the lifetime of a disk. So what you're saying is that if I burn a disk with well working equipment and the burn is successful, and then put it in a case and put the case in my safe, and don't touch it. Now if say my grandkids find this disk 60 years later(assuming they still have cd players) you don't believe it will play properly? Or perhaps not at all? I don't really know alot about how the info gets burned onto the disk, but is it the info on the disk that won't last , or the disk it's self?
And thanks again for your input, PEACE

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Poster: glenn Date: Jan 31, 2005 3:19am
Forum: etree Subject: Re: quallity loss?

The disc itself will fail eventually. Most plastics are to some extent volatile, and outgas vapor continuously. The plastic of the disc itself will eventually become brittle. However it seems likely that the disc will outlast the integrity of the data layer, as the pits and lands (1s and 0s, effectively) are microscopic, and can be affected by very small changes. Keeping the disc clean, unscratched, in a stable temperature and not exposed to prolonged UV (sunlight or fluorescent light etc.) will keep the disc 'good' for 'longer'. I think 60 years would be a mid-range optimistic estimate, but you can pretty much count on at least 5 years in reality, and some will last longer. In those 5 years, make shn or flac copies for 10 people, and the music could last forever, especially if those 10 make copies.
Use discs with a good solid opaque top layer and you increase your chances of lasting longer.

I don't make audio copies myself, I listen to shns on my computer, which is effectively my sound system. When shn files turn up 'bad' I usually can replace them real quick doing a search for the md5 string for the failed track... or contact some of my friends and see if they have it.

Always share your music a lot, and it will last forever. Maybe. It will likely outlast us at least.

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Poster: little brother Date: Jan 25, 2005 1:44pm
Forum: etree Subject: Re: quallity loss?

Thanks, that really sounds like the best long term solution, but what I'm mostly concerned with is the best way for coppying a show from the audio cd format. I can always redownload if thats the only way to assure cleanness, but it sound like I should be okay in most instanses to create a copy from a first generation disk. How ever,in the future when I come accross a show I really like and may want copies later on, I will also burn the data. So do I have to unzipp a zip file first so that the tracks are sepperated or can I simply retrieve the zip off a disk and then unzip?? Thanks again everyone....